Author Topic: Narcissists cover ups  (Read 5698 times)

2224Jessica

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Narcissists cover ups
« on: January 08, 2006, 08:08:23 PM »
Hi everyone, My Mums a Narc and I was just wondering how can they continue to keep up appearances... For example my brothers girlfriend studies Pysch and my mum at first completely fooled her by playing the "I'm sooo lucky look at all the great things things I have and I don't deserve them" I know that she doesn't mean it any of it. She also plays the "I'm a confident Christian lady" which is crap because when we were kids she would take us to church in the morning and play the whole "holy" act then later that day belt us and lock us outside allday because we were inconviencing her. Even now she pretends she is "a lovely friend" she talks the talk but yet  in her actions and intentions they are self serving. She will always talk about certain people about the fact that they don't do enough for her. Another act is "I've had such a hard life" act. She's always outdoing Dad, she wants to be more educated than him, earn more than him. She also plays the "I'm polite game" says all the right things. She doesn't have any close friends but theres lots of people that respect her. However I know there are people that are wary of her. People we grew up with, they don't say anything but yet they no longer have anything to do with my parents. My Dads mum never accepted her but tolerated her so she can be in her grandkids life. My nana was always lovely and nurturing. I have fond memories of her. My mum was always telling us how horrible she was. However she didn't tell us why and there was no evidence. I think my nana was onto her.
When I was a teenager I went to the church we were attending for help... When they called her in, she sat there and told them that I am rebellious and that I'm a liar. She also sat there and proceeded to tell them that I was a troubled child and have difficulty with authoritive and therefore I was making up stories. I was shocked. She got away with it that time but the next time a friend witnessed her abuse and told her mum and her mum thought I was a good kid and helped me. She also told the church that there are problems with my mum and that my complaints are legit. They helped me find a place to stay.
My mum still continued to tell people  how troublesome I was. However she never spoke to me the whole time I was away.
I eventually went back home after a few months hoping that she was better. She was alot better, I think she knew I would hesitate again to leave. I also learnt to do what it takes to get by. Shut up and put up. I was very sad and confused at why she was like this.   She also now has all these photos displayed all over her house of the kids and grandkids yet she doesn't even bother coming up for the grandkids birthday (she only lives 4 hours away) or even see them when she's here. We have invited her to our kids birthdays. But she will come up and want everyone to celebrate her birthday.
I just find it amazing how she always knows how to present herself.
I'm starting to understand her more and more now that I know what she is. It's like she's playing a character in a play.  I also know that she is incabable of knowing how I feel because she is so consumed with herself. She is so concerned with herself that she can't even comprehend that people live in another world who love and have feelings... Does anyone else get surprised by all the keeping up appearances act? Also I have to rethink alot of things in my past and now so many things make sense because of my new understanding of what a narcissist is....

Jessica

Hopalong

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2006, 11:04:54 PM »
Wow, J and J:
I relate to both of you.
I remember Sela's comment about the scariness of spotting the monster than noone else got to see when the mask dropped just enough for YOU to be horrified.

I think Jac that you may have overcompensated in a natural attempt to defend your psyche.
And maybe that was a true gift for your survival.

At work, or in trying to build relationships...imho, that's a time for self-protection (work) and compassion (relationships with non-serious-N others). I do believe most people, including me, go along with a certain amount of BS as part of the imperfect human condition in an imperfect world.

If you get healed from the worst N damage and can feel some compassion for not only yourself but the damaged human (I know in the worst cases it seems like a damaged animal) inside the Ns, then it gets easier to tolerate BS and foibles and still create feelings of love.

I think you're onto something and it's good you're asking yourself that question. Keep going, keep going...

Hops
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bean

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2006, 11:11:09 PM »
J, J and Hop - I relate too.

The sad fact is that your N. Mom probably knew she was in a unique position of power over you and you may have even helped rather than "exposing" her.  It's sort of like watching a train wreck when all of the pieces finally do come together, ya know?  It's mortifying but incredible all at once.

I don't know how many times I've been tempted to call up my N. parent's friends and scream at the top of my lungs "LET ME TELL YOU THE TRUTH!!!"  However, that would make me look like the crazy one, ya know?  Like they did something to me that I just can't get over--like I'm not forgiving them.  I mean, how do you sum up a lifetime of abuse in one phone call anyway?  However, that didn't stop me from emailing them and dropping hints, though :)  --I've found that people's imaginations are better than anything I could've said anyway. :)

he he he

The sad fact is all the deceit and cover ups are wrong, but be careful about dwelling too much on it, unless you're prepared to be called and labeled "the crazy one;"  I guess in my case, I didn't care what people thought of me as I'd already been the blacksheep, the scapegoat and the crazy one for years anyway.  Also, I figured if I really am crazy, I'd rather be crazy than them anyday!


From Sam Vinken's site:
V. Control by Proxy
If all else fails, the abuser recruits friends, colleagues, mates, family members, the authorities, institutions, neighbours, the media, teachers – in short, third parties – to do his bidding. He uses them to cajole, coerce, threaten, stalk, offer, retreat, tempt, convince, harass, communicate and otherwise manipulate his target. He controls these unaware instruments exactly as he plans to control his ultimate prey. He employs the same mechanisms and devices. And he dumps his props unceremoniously when the job is done.
Another form of control by proxy is to engineer situations in which abuse is inflicted upon another person. Such carefully crafted scenarios of embarrassment and humiliation provoke social sanctions (condemnation, opprobrium, or even physical punishment) against the victim. Society, or a social group become the instruments of the abuser.

Marta

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2006, 11:22:31 PM »
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Does anyone else get surprised by all the keeping up appearances act?

I am ENORMOUSLY surprised, but knowing how many decades it took me to catch on to the act and realize that it wasn't me, it was her, I am not suprised really. I think part of the reason they get away with it is because they themselves believe in their act. THat is why, when I have caught my mom in the act with documentary evidence, I intend to confront her.

Jess, i think you have been very very fortunate and lucky in many ways. First of all, you yourself knew what she was like, instead of blaming yourself. Second, you were extremely lucky to have had friends who witnessed what they saw and tried to help you. That rarely happens too, as Ns never let their cover off in front of anyone else, and even if they do, the bystanders rarely have the guts to take a stand.

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However, that would make me look like the crazy one, ya know?

I KNOW what you mean......

I think most people just lack a radar for evil, thank god.



darky

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2006, 04:23:16 AM »
i totaly agree with the others. part of the emotional abuse is teaching you to keep your mouth shut. we cover up unintentionaly but when we realise what they are its too late!!
 i used to work at the same hospital as my mum, the lies she would tell to people, building up her personality as being a perfect mother and grandmother. she would stand in front of me, blatently lying about seeing my kids, looking after them, treating them etc, it used to make my blood boil especialy as she never used to look after them or hardley see them!! if i dared to slander her, even if it was just humour i would be in for it later with the "why do you put me down" or "you always try to make people see bad in me" or you and your big mouth, you know i dont like my dirty laundry aired in public" so in the end i used to sit and take it. so for years i covered up for her lies thus making people believe she was all singing all dancing, so now who looks the bad one???? ME! try telling people now that the things she said were lies and shes not the person they think she is!!

luckily for me, i have found documentory evidence her life is a lie. i intend on bringing her down and i know just how to do it!! she used to say she didnt care what people think, yeah right!! so why didnt anyone know she had a social worker involved when i was little because of her resentment against me?? i was five years old at the time. for years she never could answer my questions and i wondered why as a child, she used to shut me up when i mentioned doctors to anyone else. now i know and so will her nearest and dearest!!

bean

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2006, 09:07:30 PM »
Oohh.  You mean you have the social worker's records?  How black and white is this evidence?  Just curious, it's sounds very juicy.  :)

One thing that my T said is: tell others in the family.  Keeping secrets about verbal and physical abuse that has gone on with you and the N won't help you.  Especially if it is very recent abuse.  You never know when something might be turned against you and then you will need that evidence, even if it's only for a bit of sanity.

The other thing I did was to give my parents a good dish of their own.  I'm typically very good at keeping secrets, but one I decided to reveal, because it really steamed me how my Dad is always acting like him and Mom are the model of perfection when it comes to being parents and as a married couple.  About a year and a half ago, my Mom confided in me that she had thought about leaving my Dad (in the recent past) due to his behavoir toward her, and she also said something that was incredible to hear for me:  she said, you know the psychiatrist said that that D has very low self esteem.  He is always comparing himself to his older brother.  I never saw myself this way, I always thought my D had high self esteem (he was always bragging and seemed confident in himself---way over confident, in fact).  When I sat back and thought about it it made a lot of sense:  his favorite thing to beat me up about is my best friend from highschool's parents and how "they divorced."  To learn my Mom had actually thought about leaving my Dad was incredible to me (they always pretended their relationship was so great--when anyone with two eyeballs could see they fought and bickered constantly).  It all kind of made sense.  I took it upon myself to share it with everyone else in the family--all my brothers and sisters and their spouses too.  I'm sure it was probably a relief to some of them (especially those of us who were divorced) to hear that the "perfect" ones were not so perfect afterall.  This was the beginning of my understanding, I think, of my Dad.  And myself.  For years, I convinced myself he was the nice one.  I thought it was all my Mom and not him.  Weird, how you want to believe and thus believe things.  It's so obvious to me now that he is just as bad if not worse than Mom.

jordanspeeps

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2006, 09:58:09 PM »
Marta said:

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I think most people just lack a radar for evil, thank god.

I'm just a little curious, Marta:  Would you mind expounding on this thought?

Tiffany

Marta

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2006, 01:20:37 AM »
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Quote
JS:
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I think most people just lack a radar for evil, thank god.

I'm just a little curious, Marta:  Would you mind expounding on this thought?

I think most of us tend to give benefit of doubt to others. She did this BECAUSE: may be she was sick, may be she was hurt, may be she was having a bad day, may be she simply reacted to something you said and didn't like.

It is only when a person has experienced evil through their own bones -- someone out to hurt others because they enjoy it, need it, just because -- that we become awarre of another dimension of human psyche. I think Scott Peck discusses this very well in his book. He says that the first thing evil causes in normal people is confusion. People are confused because we are looking for natural logical explanations as to why x was done. We never look for the irrational, which is where evil resides. For example, I've become a lot better at spotting destructive people over time and seeing through the facade.

Of course, the innocents who've never had a serious encounter with evil are blessed and we need them, we need their innocence and ability to trust to counter our fear and paranoia, so thank god that they exist and are around us. 

darky

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2006, 05:53:35 AM »
 bean,,,,,,social workers notes AND doctor and hosptal notes landing my mother right deep in her own poop!!  :P best bit is she dont even know,,,,,,, YET. i only have one shot at this, so im taking my time!!

helena

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2006, 06:23:42 PM »
Hi Jessica
nice to see someone else who had problem with their mom. I have just realised that my mother is a narcissit since a few days. SHe has quite frankly ruined my life. I try to pick up the pieces and I think it will work out but I have realised it a bit too late. IT's similar things she always does things when noone sees. And o boy how she can bully me. It's her fault that I have fallen in a black hole maybe 15 years ago. Now I am quite happy have just a newborn daughter but since I got a bit sick psychotic when ai waited her the first months the socials came to visit me and my boyfriend in my flat with the baby. Because of that my parents started to bully me again. Especially now when my boyfriend is in France and I have spent the newyear alone with my parents and the baby. My mother really is so mean. She talks badly about people so they think I have talken badly aboutthem. She let's other people believe that I have never earned my living. Which is not true ai have worked as a language teacher for four years and have quite a good salary. Now we had a meeting withtwo psychologists and my parents because of the fact that the socials came to visit me and for four weeks since my boyfriend has been to France they have really used this against me. I don't care so much, at first I was a bit sad since I have started with homeopathic medication and do sports and yoga and really for the first time in my life feels really good. I also know that the socials saw that it was OK here and they also has a lot of routine work. However my parents my mother being a pathological  narcissist quite ugly people. THought it was awful having to be in contact with such an institution and have used this against me the whole weekend. I read somewhere too that narcissit hate such institutions and it fits for my mother I don't really give a shit since I have nothing to fear.
I was so happy having revealed the truth about my mother finally and how she all my live has been mean to me. I always thought when I was a child that she was kind to me I was always happy,  worked well in school and had quite a lot of friends.But now I understand that we really have stop to see each other otherwise she will only continue to ruine my life.. I only hope the psycholge will understand that I am better off without her. I will have to take care of my daughter by myself. But I prefer it like that.
They are really dangerous and like someone say my father is almost worse than her as he is such a good actor he can tell you a lie straight to your face and he really takes other people for idiots. I don't like them and have to spend so much time with them because my boyfriend who by the way is french works on boats. Well there are others with similar problems so I am still happy that I finally have revealed the truth.bye bye helena but maybe it's better not to speak out loud...

roaring dad

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Re: Narcissists cover ups
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2006, 08:57:58 PM »
I can relate, but I find that with my ex her life is not a matter of cover ups.  Rather, she absolutely believes the things she says are true.  She will say or do something completely outrageous, but to her it is true.  She could probably pass a lie detector test with no problem because in her mind she is not lying or covering up. 

Forget having an arguement too.  She can change tracks faster than you can counter them.  She could start a conversation saying one thing and end it completely contradicting herself.  And to her it is very rational.

I used to ask myself why people don't see through her.  But I am starting to understand now.  Heck, it took me 8 years to see through it.  She has a very charming and charismatic front.  She can charm just about anyone.  But only a certain type of person sticks around.  These are people, in my opinion, who lack self esteem, people who are looking for a strong shining type.  She surrounds herself with these people, and in turn they shower her with attention and feed her ego.  People do see through her, but they don't stick around.